xkcd #2940: Modes of Transportation
Title Text:
My bold criticism might anger the hot air balloon people, which would be a real concern if any of them lived along a very narrow line directly upwind of me.
alt-text:
A chart that categorizes various modes of transportation based on their practicality and danger level:
Zone of Practicality:
- Trains
- Airliners
- Boats
- Walking
- Cars
- Scooters
- Bicycles
Zone of Specialty and Recreational Vehicles:
- Motorcycles
- Helicopters
- Light aircraft
- Go karts
- Skateboards
- Rollerblades
- Skis
- Unicycles
- Sleds
- Bumper cars
???:
- Hot air balloons
“Hot air balloons are the optimal mode of transportation, if your optimization algorithm has a sign error.”
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I cant believe bicycles and scooters are perceived as more dangerous than cars. They’re slower, offer better visibility, and kill way less people.
Less dangerous to others, but more dangerous to the users themselves, I suppose.
Because of cars
Not only. I live in Norway, where pedestrians have right of way and drivers are extremely careful. Discounting the risk from cars, there’s still more personal danger to users of scooters as opposed to cars. If you have an accident on a scooter, you’ll get scrapes, bruises, broken bones. As compared to a car, where unless you’ve really screwed up, you’re unlikely to take any injuries at all.
Source: scooter user who HAS broken bones
The chart needs a third dimension: danger to you, danger to others, and convenience for travel.
I think most normal people can understand the difference intuitively without needing it spelled out.
I just saw a pedestrian get hit by a person on a bike and end up with a concussion. Bicyclists don’t give a fuck about others
Driving a car makes it more likely for your species to go extinct. Infinitely more dangerous than a bicycle.
your beef is with internal combustion engine, not with the car.
Microplastics from heavy vehicles scrubbing away their tires is a bigger issue than tailpipe emissions, which is why tailpipe emissions are the only thing focused on with regards to regulatory standards. Can’t have people thinking BEVs are similar/worse for the environment than a small car.
ok, that’s fair, never thought of that…
Replace every single ICE with a BEV. Still plenty of beef.
Shame this comic doesn’t draw a distinction
Hit a pothole going 25mph in your car. Hit the same pothole going 25mph on your scooter. I’ll come visit you in the hospital after the scooter one and we can talk about how cars are obviously safer.
I ride an electric scooter, all it takes is one crack in the road that I’m less than prepared for and I’m going down hard.
I wonder what kind of scooter most people pictured when reading the comic
That is a good point, mine is the second variety, electric one similar to the ones you see littering any major Urban area waiting to be rented. Although even the largest scooter is still far less safe over a pothole or around a rainy curve than a car, typical accident in the car you mess up the car and get a bruise from the airbag, but a typical scooter accident can be a lot more gnarly.
I think most people in the USA refer to the third item as a moped, which only gives you two categories for scooter. Scooter and electric scooter, and then moped and electric moped.
I own an electric scooter very similar to the second one pictured (minus the RGB) so that’s what I was thinking of.
The roads are shit here. So badly cracked that I vibrate violently when I try to ride my scooter over them at like 10km/h. And that’s while dodging potholes.
Heeeeell no. I had I minor fall on a scooter last week. I slipped at medium speed because of an uneven wet floor. I’m still fucked up and can’t walk properly
They are more dangerous exactly because of the existence of cars. Cars are a small fortress that makes others less safe while keeping its contents safer. Unless they hit another fortress.
Even if there were no cars, I imagine biking is still less safe than walking. Just like running is less safe than walking.
I’m almost afraid to ask where you’ve been walking.
That only makes sense if you cycle among cars, but that makes cars dangerous, not bikes. If you remove cars out of equation by cycling on pavement or cycle route, the danger is gone.
Pedestrians get hit by cars all the time yet walking is rated the safest.
If you remove cars out of equation by cycling on pavement or cycle route, the danger is gone.
If you remove air out of the equation the danger of helicopters are gone
Pedestrians don’t get hit by cars quite as much as cyclist, proportionally to their number, because cyclists are right in the street sharing the space with cars, trucks and buses. Cycling on the sidewalk is not allowed, and cycling lanes are often very dangerous. I understand that this chart is talking about danger to the passengers, not to others.
A mere fender bender on a car might be a life or death situation if you’re riding a motorcycle.
Hmm. It seems that Sync posted my draft comment 😔
Well try getting hit by a car while walking. According to this xkcd you’ll be the safest.
kill way less people
I believe the danger axis is about danger to the passengers, not others
Tell you what, you drive your bike into a car and maybe the concussion will change your thinking enough to make it believable that bikes are more dangerous.
We’re not rating danger for the damn planet here. It’s obviously danger for the user - that’s the one who’s buying the product. Why would anyone care about the safety of others over their own safety?
Why would anyone care about the safety of others over their own safety?
As long as I can slice vegetables using my car door I don’t give a damn about pedestrians.
I will literally shit inside any human being I don’t personally know (and some that I do know) if it makes my life 0.02% more comfortable. What’s your point?
The tone and content of this message indicate
a severe lack of empathy and a high degree of self-centeredness, verging on sociopathic tendencieslulz, you know how to underscore a perspective right there! I wonder if that is a brand new sentence…No need to indulge but since you got me thinking about self interest and empathy:
If you had the opportunity to gain an extra hour of sleep the next time you wanted it, but in return, someone you don’t know would experience moderate discomfort for ten years. Would you be willing to make that trade-off?
We’re talking about me now? No. Of course not. Just like I wouldn’t knowingly buy a car whose making process involves some random people being shit inside of. I find hyperbolic exaggerations funny and I like to use them for making a point.
The point was - you don’t purchase things for others, you purchase them for yourself. A car can be a major money spender - you buy it because it gives YOU safety, and it’s silly to act like you’re a bad person for spending your money in a way that benefits you. But some Knights of the Broken Tire are out here pretending like they’re damn selfless, like they spent all their house money on housing the homeless not their own family, and like they chose to carry that 2 year old through traffic on a bycicle, not a fucking minivan. Fuck right off with this hypocritical shit. It’s okay to want the safety of yourself and your family, that’s how the entire world works. You’re not gonna get blamed for buying a car, drop the selfless, holier-than-thou act, nobody’s buying it.
I find hyperbolic exaggerations funny and I like to use them for making a point.
Good way to distract from and undermine your points, as in this case.
I have it on good authority they got banned for abusing the report feature, so I guess we’ll never know how they might respond.
Oh I think you made the point better than me. As it is written somewhere, live by the sword die by the sword. I hope you enjoy your bowl of shit.
This is wildly dependent on infrastructure. Both for the convenience and danger axis.
motorcycles should 100% be in the zone of practicality, especially with modern sleek electric ones.
skateboards should be the bridge between practical and recreational, provided you have sensible infrastructure and short distances they have distinct benefits.
skis and sleds just need snow to make sense
I think the existence of car drivers increases their danger level massively
Apparently alcohol as well as it is involved in something like 50% of motorcycle fatalities.
it annoys me to no end how motorcycles and mopeds are viewed as dangerous, when every single time you hear about people being hurt on them it’s because they’re fucking idiots who tried to do a backflip infront of a semitruck
Horses are technically more dangerous to ride than motorcycles. It’s just that motorcycles attract a kind of people who like doing backflips in front of a semi truck.
sure but that applies to everything, if you want to be safe then the only time you should ever be on a road is inside a bus.
I’m here to say that if there’s snow, skis win on practicality. Almost every winter, there’s at least one day when you will have some people skiing to work in Oslo, a city of 700 000 inhabitants, with a metro system. Because when there’s 10 cm of snow in the streets, skis are the quickest and easiest way to get anywhere.
You can be a skilled rider and still and a fall. More likely is that an unsafe car driver will do something that causes an accident.
But hardly for hot air balloons
Yeah, the joke and alt text are delivered quite nicely.
The placement of „Skis“ in this will trigger every Scandinavian I know. Should definitely be in the top left.
Trust you on that but will ski across the pond to check and be sure
Even us close to Scandinavia get triggered. There aren’t that many practical ways to get around at winter. Skis work when feet don’t.
I’m from the Scandinavian country WITHOUT mountains and with less snow and am as such not triggered.
You don’t know me, though, so I guess your statement might still hold true 😁
Scandinavia is their zone of specialty
In Canada too. It’s not that common, but also not out of place to see people doing their regular commute on skis.
Unicycles are clearly more dangerous than skis.
Cross country ski vs downhill ski
Technicalities:
Planes are safer per mile but not per trip. One could argue that if people spent the same amount of time in both then it would be far more fatalities on aircrafts.
Cars are technically the major source of danger for bikes and scooters.
also a fun fact, while commercial aviation is very safe, private planes are much more dangerous, being almost as dangerous per mile as a regular car (and you get a lot more miles per hour of travel)
That already fits with the chart - “commercial aviation” is “airlines” and “private planes” are “light aircraft”.
how did I miss that…
private planes are much more dangerous, being almost as dangerous per mile as a regular car
that is because they are operated by semi-competent people who often have less practice then they have in car.
imagine how competent driver you are when you have your fresh license. it is the same with piloting license. and now imagine you are a hobby pilot and can afford to spend in the cockpit 3 hours per month. your skill is not really going to get significantly better. you are probably flying airplane that is at the end of its life, because that is only one you can afford, and there may be no one keeping an eye on you telling you “this is not how we do it, it is risky, dangerous, and you will get someone killed”.
Someone else put it this way.
Sometimes I walk to work; sometimes I drive my car; other times i ride a bicycle. Whichever option I pick, I hate anyone who isn’t doing the same thing.
That’s not true. When I drive I still hate drivers
A therapist once told me that who you are when you drive is who you really are.
I don’t drive, so I guess I’m a nobody.
That may be the most American thing anyone has ever said!
Also, the same therapist told me that she has a number of alcoholic patients who moved to New York City simply because they knew there was a good 24 hour mass transit system and they wouldn’t have to drive drunk.
Sora wants to know your location
This seems totally rational to me. I think we might have a problem.
Are hot air balloon not like super safe, last accident I think was a guy that made his own DIY hot air balloon but before that it has been relatively safe. I think America has only seen like less than 800 deaths total.
If the comic put in zeppelins…
You’d need to normalize the number to deaths per balloon ride.
Only three people died last year playing Russian Roulette, must be pretty safe! /s
Not sure I’d put unicycles as being safer than bicycles.
I’d guess it’s because unicycles are used in a much narrower range of circumstances. Few people are being hit by cars commuting to work on a unicycle, nor are there many mountain-unicyclists getting injured.
Which honestly just speaks for the insane amount of training mountain-unicyclists have done
You joke (I think?), but the people I know that do unicycling (including mountain-bike style unicycling, and unicycling Himalayan trails, and crazy stuff like that) do do an insane amount of training 😆
You’d have to. Anyone who mountain bikes regularly knows how much work it is to climb some trails with 500% gear range. I can’t imagine the work involved with a single gear to climb on some trails. Brutal.
This is probably another reason why unicycles are less dangerous. People I know that do mountain biking end up in hospital from time to time from coming off at speed, speed on most unicycles is probably a lot lower. Though I thought geared unicycles existed?
I was joking, but i guess now i know what im gonna watch on youtube next
It’s probably there because you don’t reach as high speeds on a unicycle
There are basically no unsafe ways to get off of a unicycle. You can fall in any direction and just end up standing next to your unicycle. Compare that to a bicycle “over the handle bars”-accident.
Bicycles are only more dangerous than cars because of cars.
Also, only less convenient than cars because of cars
That’s just not true, try getting groceries on your bike
Literally how I always do my grocery shopping.
For a family or only for yourself?
I only live by myself but if you need larger shipping trips, there’s cargo bikes for that.
Didn’t consider that, fair enough I suppose
Hot air balloons are a very useful mode of transportation if your goal is to take aerial photographs from them (although admittedly nowadays you could also use drones). It’s always a question of what you want to achieve.
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Aerial_photographs_from_hot_air_balloons
Interesting, that’s the closest thing I’ve seen to a personal photo album on Wikipedia.
It is Wikimedia Commons, not Wikipedia. That is where most of the images used on Wikipedia and other WMF projects are stored. It has categories for nearly everything under the sun.
Randall is offically carpilled
Bicycles more dangerous than cars? I guess I must have missed all the stories about people being run over by bikes.
I think it means more dangerous to use, not more dangerous to be around.
Unless you have pepper infrastructure.
Edit: sorry that’s not true, see this from the Netherlands:
Voor het vierde jaar op rij kwamen meer fietsers (270; 39%) dan inzittenden van personenauto’s (194; 28%) om in het verkeer. De meeste doden in het verkeer vallen onder ouderen: in 2023 waren 375 (55%) verkeersdoden 60 jaar of ouder. Kinderen (0-14 jaar) komen juist relatief weinig om in het verkeer; in 2023 waren dat er 20 (3%). Het risico om te overlijden in het verkeer, het aantal verkeersdoden per afgelegde kilometer, is het ho ogst voor gemotoriseerde tweewielers. Het risico voor brom- en snorfietsers en motorrijders is ongeveer dertig keer zo hoog als het risico voor inzittenden van een personenauto. Voor fietsers en voetgangers is het overlijdensrisico respectievelijk acht en zes keer zo hoog als voor auto-inzittenden, in de periode 2012-2021.
Translation:
For the fourth year in a row, more cyclists (270; 39%) than passenger car occupants (194; 28%) were killed in traffic. Most traffic fatalities occur among the elderly: in 2023, 375 (55%) traffic fatalities were 60 years or older. Children (0-14 years) are relatively rarely killed in traffic; in 2023 there were 20 (3%). The risk of dying in traffic, the number of traffic fatalities per kilometer travelled, is highest for motorized two-wheelers. The risk for moped and light-moped riders and motorcyclists is approximately thirty times higher than the risk for passenger car occupants. For cyclists and pedestrians, the risk of death is eight and six times higher, respectively, than for car occupants, in the period 2012-2021.
Also, bikes more dangerous than unicycles?
I’ve never seen some ride a unicyle on a road in regular traffic, which is where most of the danger of riding a bike is.
Do those electric unicycles without a seat count? Because those are weaving through traffic at insane speeds all the time where I live.
Oh wow, never seen one of these. No idea.
Bike on pedestrian violence is an epidemic!
I see what you mean about net safety and not just thinking about the operator of the mode of transport. Will look into this later.
and i suppose blimps and dirigibles are further to the right and lower than the graph displays u_u
where to put my 3 favorites? hovercraft, monorail and blimp
Those first two are incredibly fit for some niche that is so small that nobody even remembers it exists.
The last one is still more practical than hot air balloons.
I watched a documentary once about the dangers of monorails. The conductor had possums in the wiring. He called the big one Bitey.
Even with heavier propulsion, blimps and rigid airships are completely beholden to the weather as a light breeze can completely prevent landing or cause crashes.
I’m not sure I agree that unicycles are safer than roller blades. But that’s probably because I am comfortable on roller blades and don’t know how to unicycle, so for me, the opposite is true.
As both an extreme unicyclist & rollerblader, unicycles are actually incredibly safe. More safe than a bicycle. The top speed is very slow comparatively, and if you fall… You fall on your feet. Forwards? Feet. Backwards? Feet. Sideways? Feet. If your feet were strapped into the pedals (like rollerblades…) it would be a deathtrap.
I suspect that roller blades have much higher top speed, as well as being much more susceptible to small rocks
Trains and planes and others are a bit wonky for this chart. If I needed to take get to work, train and plane immediately resort to walking the entire way (unless get in a car, on a bike, fall just after). So while traveling across the country for a trip may be convenient on a train… Wait, unless I only have the weekend or a short work trip/vacation, because then it would take to much time and be inconvenient. Tried to find an example. Travel to Las Vegas from Nashville. Plane, ~3 hour flight plus let’s say 2 hour travel and airport bs. So 5 hours there, 5 back. Driving: 26 hours (each way). Walking: Death by dehydration in desert. Train: not even listed as there was no routes.
What about pogo sticks?
Less convient but also less dangerous then hot air ballons
